Sarge's time is upon us.

[steve_sarge]

Hey guys (and Gals)

The time is almost near where I can consider yet another build. I'm going to list my parts and then ask for advice on better options. I realise it is damn overkill in a LOT of aspects and can appreciate the views some have toward that.

Here goes...

MoBo: EVGA x58 SLI Classified
CPU: i7 975 EX (D0 obviously)
RAM: Corsair TR36G200C8GTF (Thinking 12GB, need opinions)
GPU: EVGA GTX 295 RED Ed. Quad SLI
****EVGA 9800GT Superclocked (PhysX Card)
PSU: Enermax Revolution 85+SLI 1250W (Thoughts?)
Sound: Creative X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty
HDDs: Intel X-25M 80GB x2 in RAID (This I need lots of advice)
HD103UJ 1TB SATA2 Purely for Storage
Case: Keen on the Lian Li PC-60FW Black case but settling on the CoolerMaster HAF 922 Case
(due to the apparent lack of cable management for the MoBo Power Cables)
Monitor: Dell 2709W 1920x1200Max Res. (I'd easily opt for the 30" but can't justify the drop in FPS@that res or the $1k for 3")

OK... The bits I need advice on and I know you guys are more than great for realistic advice.

A) Is 12G of RAM well and truly overkill? Will 6 be plenty for getting into Vid Editing (As a minor hobby) and Gaming

B) The SSD debarcle is more than confusing. Is there going to be a benefit to me running Vista 64 / 7 x64 on a RAID setup on SSD??? I'm a bit concerned about the slowdown, failure, life span of the SSDs and need some real world advice on this one. I was considering 2xVelociraptors 300GB but the trend is going toward SSD.

C) The PSU seems to be a choice more on aesthetics and I know SFA about the Enermax reliability with what I'm planning on putting together.

Please feel free to dump any advice on my plate as I haven't even come close to ordering the parts yet (Still waiting on the car to come out of the repair shop and what budget I'm actually willing to spend on this)

So far with everything listed, this is going to set me back in excess of $9000 AUD or £4500. YES, that is a lot of monika, but... This will likely be a build that will see me out for a few years to come and I'll not need to improve anything in the forseeable future. I am only going this far as I think there will be enough left in the play monies we'll have after our home improvements (TV, Sound, Car, Toy Car e.t.c.) NO, I'm not rich or a lottery winner, just wanting a rock solid rig to play with and not hitting ANY walls (Shy of Water Cooling if the need arises)

I've been reading a lot of the OCing results out of the D0's in general and I'm impressed at what is attainable on a good Air Cooled setup. I was going to go complete WC, until I realised I can't get the factory WC'd GPUs in Australia. EVGA sell a better clocked Hydro GTX 295 for around $100 USD more than the stock and it is actually more viable than me messing up an aftermarket cooler setup when I can't bear the thought of pulling apart a card at the risk of damaging something. The other deterrent was the lack of room inside a "Nice Looking Case" to setup a Rad.

My whole theming thing on this build will be trying to stick with the Black and Red setup that the board reaks of. The RAM may be overkill for the 2000MHz kit, but the 1866 Kit is only £50 cheaper.

OK. there's my dribble. Any input is fantastic. Cheers

[GSte]

Only quick answers as I'm in a rush here, 12GB RAM is complete overkill, 6GB is easily enough for anything bar the most extreme situations, SSDs - I have the same worries as you in terms of reliability, and as performance is increasing all the time, the Intel ones are a waste of money imo as they will no doubt be surpassed by a better product in the very near future. I'd never spend the extra on an extreme CPU either as the 920s go plenty high, doubt the extra MHz from an extreme would ever be used, but that's your choice of course. Much prefer WD HDDs for reliability, have you considered a 1TB Caviar Black?

Gotta run, just a few thoughts for you there.

[Peter_Enis]

Originally Posted by steve_sarge

Hey guys (and Gals)


Here goes...

MoBo: EVGA x58 SLI Classified
CPU: i7 975 EX (D0 obviously)
RAM: Corsair TR36G200C8GTF (Thinking 12GB, need opinions)
GPU: EVGA GTX 295 RED Ed. Quad SLI
****EVGA 9800GT Superclocked (PhysX Card)
PSU: Enermax Revolution 85+SLI 1250W (Thoughts?)
Sound: Creative X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty
HDDs: Intel X-25M 80GB x2 in RAID (This I need lots of advice)
HD103UJ 1TB SATA2 Purely for Storage
Case: Keen on the Lian Li PC-60FW Black case but settling on the CoolerMaster HAF 922 Case
(due to the apparent lack of cable management for the MoBo Power Cables)
Monitor: Dell 2709W 1920x1200Max Res. (I'd easily opt for the 30" but can't justify the drop in FPS@that res or the $1k for 3")

I think 1250W is exaggerating it 1000 should be enough, i think even 800 shall do it.

case: i made a simliar decission about a year ago and i went for the lian li....and it´s a great case i´d always go again for it....

ram: yes 6gb should do it easily

soundcard: i had to get a new one to about 2 weeks ago and i went for an asus xonar...sound is insane. this is definetly an options to think about

greetz

[Clunk]

Originally Posted by steve_sarge

Here goes...

MoBo: EVGA x58 SLI Classified
CPU: i7 975 EX (D0 obviously)
RAM: Corsair TR36G200C8GTF (Thinking 12GB, need opinions)
GPU: EVGA GTX 295 RED Ed. Quad SLI
****EVGA 9800GT Superclocked (PhysX Card)
PSU: Enermax Revolution 85+SLI 1250W (Thoughts?)
Sound: Creative X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty
HDDs: Intel X-25M 80GB x2 in RAID (This I need lots of advice)
HD103UJ 1TB SATA2 Purely for Storage
Case: Keen on the Lian Li PC-60FW Black case but settling on the CoolerMaster HAF 922 Case
(due to the apparent lack of cable management for the MoBo Power Cables)
Monitor: Dell 2709W 1920x1200Max Res. (I'd easily opt for the 30" but can't justify the drop in FPS@that res or the $1k for 3")

Steve, don't do it mate

There's a few things there that don't quite make any sense.

The 975 CPU - this won't make your PC any faster, in fact, if you look around at the reviews, most of them are stuck around 4.2/4.3GHz, so for a 1000 CPU, I'd say that's not great value, overclocking wise, when you look at what a 920 D0 can do (4.4GHz relatively easily) - Saying that, with 12GB of memory on board, it's unlikely you'll get to those kind of speeds without a lot of QPI/VTT voltage.

Quad SLI on 1920x1200 - it will make your E-penis huge , but it's not going to make your gaming experience any better - one good card, or at a push, two good cards should do everything you need.

The X-25M drives are great, but one will probably be faster in many real life applications and much less hassle when it goes wrong. Maybe look at a larger capacity single drive?

My experience with Enermax PSUs has been quite poor, so I can't comment there.

Finally, I just want to say that you should really avoid planning a Gaming PC build that's going to last you " a few years" - it just doesn't happen. Once the latest and greatest games hit the shelves next year and your cards can't run them in DX11 or whatever, you'll no doubt wonder why you wasted all that cash on 3 or 4 cards that are obsolete so soon

[steve_sarge]

Dang, you guys are quick.

Thanks for the input on the RAM. I think the 6GB will be the go. The Quad SLI at the Res I'm planning is more for the likes of Crysis and FC2 with some decent AA/AF settings. If I was to go for the 30" monitor, the Frame Rates would nearly be unplayable (well, not smooth anyway).

I've not thought of the Caviar Drives at all to be honest as I lack the desired knowledge about HDDs in general.

The Creative soundcard was an aesthetic choice over the Auzentech X-Fi Forte as it covers the PCB Nicely and offers Creative's Patented EAX goodies. As far as I know, the ASUS card emulates this EAX stuff and I'd be going on a limb to listen to something that "emulates" the game enhancements as opposed to either the X-fi or the Auzentech (I'd actually prefer the Auzentech for the features and Creative's somewhat tarnished Rep in the past).

The X25's are something I'm thinking about based purely on internet research and I have NO idea what better option there is in the way of SSD's. Being that the SSD's ARE so confusing, I'm nearly of the opinion of sticking with the good 'ol faithful mechanical drives. Hell. I've had one of mine for around 4 years and it still just plain works. 2 Velociraptors in RAID would seem faesible??? At least I would have a helluva lot better capacity AND know I have some sort of guaranteed quality. There is just a wee bit too much negativity about SSD Slowdowns, failures and loss of info for me to seem happy enough to fork out that much money for one only to need to wipe it every so often.

I tend to agree with the 1250W PSU being too much for my needs and originally I was going for the Corsair HX1000. The only reason I jumped to the 1250 was the COMPLETE Cable management it offers and the black and red colour.

Peter. How did you go with Cable Management in the Lian Li??? I have an Antec 900 atm and hate the lack of ability to keep things tidy and hidden and looking at pics of the LL cases I'm keen on, looks like there isn't really any adequate cutouts for the MoBo cable to exit from.

So in summary, I'm nearly almost convinced to scrap the Intel Drives and go 300GB VRs and the WD Caviar Black (Just read some reviews and it is VERY impressive for what it is.

6GB of RAM (next bit is... is 2000MHz really going to be beneficial or will the 1866 suffice.) I'm not planning on sending any frequency into the stratosphere on such a setup, merely going for overkill to start with so I don't have to push TOO much.

The "few year" bit was actually a bit of sarcasm on my behalf Dave (I only built this on 11 months ago). I know nothing lasts much more than 2 in the gaming scene and as soon as I build it, there'll be better revisions and bigger games to lap it all up. I have a BIG thumbs up from wifey with an open mind about what i want and only this real opportunity to go ALL out. I'm only saving some future upgrading and expansion by smacking all in one hit.

Cheers for the helpful replies (as always) guys. I'll revise my list tomorrow after work and see if I can shave enough to warrant the extra 3" of Dell Pleasure. On that note, do any of you guys know of quality 30" monitors OTHER than Dell or Apple??? The Apple monitors are sexxy, but nearly twice the price of the similar sized Dell one.

[Peter_Enis]

Originally Posted by steve_sarge

Dang, you guys are quick.

Peter. How did you go with Cable Management in the Lian Li??? I have an Antec 900 atm and hate the lack of ability to keep things tidy and hidden and looking at pics of the LL cases I'm keen on, looks like there isn't really any adequate cutouts for the MoBo cable to exit from.

You are right on this point. I have an A71B case and it has got no "cuts or holes" at the back plate. so this case you need to modify for hiding all cables.... but there are cases who do..

maybe this page offers more clearance to you
Lian Li PC-A71 B good bad or what? (pictures)

[Clunk]

Steve, one cheap (ish) SSD will absolutely destroy a pair of raptors in RAID in access times - this is where you see the differences most, loading times, everything is so much more snappy than with a mechanical drive...in fact, I'd say to get a mechanical drive, set up your system and use it for a week or two and then get an SSD, use that for a week or two and then go back to the mechanical drive and it's quite awful . Even in the sequential reads and writes, you'll still be looking at silly high speeds from a decent SSD, so theres no real need to go with a raptor or raptors, they are just more heat and noise, although not as bad as they used to be.

Why not go for the top spec monitor you want and get a 920 and overclock it?...with that EVGA board you should be able to get it running at a minimum of 4.0GHz stable, unless you're really unlucky, but that's the gamble with overclocking, even the 965 and 975 chips have their bad clockers.

[affiliate13]

Steve you seem like a good guy so id like to save you some money and hassle.

i7 975s are mostly if not all awful unless on LN2. Seriously they are truly awful for £850. I would get a 920 most of the D0s will do 4.2-4.4Ghz stable on less that 1.425v. Ive not seen many 975s in reviews do much more and often less. Dunno why just read around and you will see yourself.
If you really feel you want a boost then wait for some reviews of 950s they may prove better or possibly some of those W3xx Xeons which are getting some nice numbers back now too.

Classifieds are again good with LN2 but there are only marginal gains over some of the other X58s out there. However it does look the best of them all imo.

X25s are proven over and over again to be superb SSDs with the latest firmware update, excellent random write performance, but expensive and small capacities but their new 32nm drives are appearing shortly. The Samsung PB22-J offers the best value and OCZ vertex + other indilix based are a direct competitor to the X25s and seem to represent very similar performance with higher sequential writes to boot.

As for the RAM Clunk had mentioned that anything over 1600mhz doesnt make much of a difference but the Corsairs would look great in the Classified. 12GB is really not nescessary and i would say get cheaper RAM with tighter timings and add more if you need it later. I wouldnt like to guess what Vdimm/QPI you would need to run 12GB at anything close to 2000mhz C8.

The 2x 295s are about the only setup that could run Crysis on a 30" with everything turned up but as a suggestion get one and see how you go 1st.


Now ignore everything i just said and get the Corsair 2000C7 6GBx2, 2x295s, 3x80GB X25s R0, Classsified water cooled with those gorgeous bitspower or EK blocks and a 2x560mm rads.

...just dont buy a 975 they are just a step too far into insanity imo.

[steve_sarge]

Dammit. Had a reply going while researching the CPUs and lost it by accidentally closing the window.

6GB RAM it is. Maybe even just the 1866 stuff (which are the C7 kit). I don't think I'll push too far on the Memory Clocks anyhoo.

HDD... I should leap into a Higher Cap SSD {OCZ Summit 250GB (Samsung Controller based)} and go for a WD Cav Black 1TB (the reviews do look VERY enticing)

CPU. Bye bye 975, hello Xeon / 950. The XEONs definitely look like a great CPU and seemingly compatible with the MoBo I'm planning on. Just gotta work out the Differences per CPU to see what is going to be more beneficial to me. The XEON is clocked slightly lower than the 950, is around £50 more and I'm hoping someone can tell me what the benefits of IT compared to the 950 would be. I'm more than happy to fork out the extra 50 Quid for a better product, but how would it be different in real world apps and Gaming???

CASE. The A77 looks like a dead set winner all round I think. How hard would a WC setup be to install on it Dave??? I see you are quite the one for paying attention to detail on your review and I'm actually trying to figure out if I could install the WC Unit Internally on the A77??? I'm keen on a side window still to admire the goodies while I sit next to it also, so if the Lian Li cases are going to give me grief with Internally WCing, are there better options out there??? I know I liked my Antec case to start with, but I'm more than over it now.

Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts guys. I do always appreciate being brought back to reality every so often.

[Pastie]

There's been some good watercooled systems in the A77 - the best I've seen for space utilisation are Seba84 2005 's " carbon edition " & Vailspartan 's from overclock.net


seba84 2005's watercooled lianli A77b


vailspartans watercooled LianLi A77



Seba84 2005 's system is why I eventually decided on my A77b